February 26, 2024 • 2hr 54min

Dr. Becky Kennedy: Protocols for Excellent Parenting & Improving Relationships of All Kinds

Huberman Lab

In this episode, Dr. Andrew Huberman interviews Dr. Becky Kennedy, a clinical psychologist specializing in parent-child relationships. They dive deep into what it means to be a "sturdy" parent, the core jobs of parenting, how to navigate challenging emotions and behaviors in kids, the teenage years, and much more.

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Key Takeaways

Being a sturdy parent means having the ability to stay connected to yourself and your child at the same time, setting boundaries while providing empathy and validation.
A parent's job is to set boundaries (things we tell people we will do that require the other person to do nothing) and provide empathy/validation (seeing someone else's feelings as real).
Saying "I believe you" to a child about their feelings and experiences is immensely powerful for building their confidence and self-trust.
Instead of trying to control kids' behavior through rewards and punishments, focus on understanding the underlying feelings and lack of skills driving the behavior, and help them build those skills.
Allow kids to experience frustration and learn to cope with it, as "kids are born with all the feelings and none of the skills to manage those feelings." - Dr. Becky Kennedy (28:10)
With teens, continue to be a sturdy, connecting presence even as they pull away. Slip notes under the door, inviting conversation and expressing love, while allowing their feelings.
Seek therapy for your child if you notice concerning signs, and don't let their reluctance stop you. Clearly express it's your job to keep them safe, not happy with you.
Exposure to small, age-appropriate frustrations and learning to tolerate them is an antidote to entitlement, which is really a fear of frustration.

Introduction

In this episode, Dr. Andrew Huberman interviews Dr. Becky Kennedy, a clinical psychologist specializing in parent-child relationships. They dive deep into what it means to be a "sturdy" parent, the core jobs of parenting, how to navigate challenging emotions and behaviors in kids, the teenage years, and much more.

While the discussion centers on parenting, the principles apply to all human relationships, including how we relate to ourselves. Dr. Kennedy shares a wealth of knowledge and highly practical strategies to improve our ability to connect with others while staying true to ourselves.

Topics Discussed

Sturdiness and the Two Jobs of Parenting (6:41)

Dr. Kennedy defines sturdiness as the ability to be connected to yourself and someone else at the same time. A parent's two key jobs are:

Setting boundaries - Telling people what you will do that requires them to do nothing. This keeps parents connected to their own values, wants and needs.
Providing empathy and validation - Seeing the child's feelings as real, even if you don't agree with or want to condone the behavior that stems from those feelings.

These two jobs allow a parent to be a sturdy leader. "Boundaries keep us connected to ourselves. They represent our values and our wants and our needs. And in a parent-child relationship, they also keep our kids safe." - Dr. Becky Kennedy (11:20)

Rewards, Punishments and Believing in Kids' Inherent Goodness (18:23)

Dr. Kennedy questions the assumption that we need rewards and punishments to shape kids' behavior. She posits that kids are inherently good inside, and their "bad" behaviors stem from having big feelings without the skills to manage them.

Instead of trying to control behavior, she suggests focusing on building skills and understanding:

Assume the most generous interpretation for concerning behaviors
Express that you're on the same team as your child in solving problems
Help them brainstorm solutions and build skills, rather than imposing a system of carrots and sticks

"Kids do have something in them where they want to feel like a purposeful, meaningful part of society...What would help you remember [to clear your plate]? We literally did this with my son, who always had his towel on the floor...He literally wrote a post-it note on his door that says 'Pick up my towel.' Trying to facilitate him solving his own problems." - Dr. Becky Kennedy (29:48)

Impingement, Boundaries and Empathy (31:54)

When facing a child's resistance to something like attending an undesired social event, Dr. Kennedy recommends holding the boundary while empathizing with their feelings:

"I believe you. I know you want to play football all day, and the kid your age there hates football...And in this family, we know that sometimes we have to do things we don't love to do...for a family experience. I know you have it in you to do your best to be polite and engaged. I know you're a good kid, and this isn't what you want. And I know we're going to get through it." - Dr. Becky Kennedy (39:36)

This validates the child's experience and autonomy, while maintaining the necessary limit. It's a "both/and" rather than "either/or" approach.

Responding to "I Hate You" (51:15)

When a child lashes out with "I hate you," Dr. Kennedy suggests first doing nothing and allowing the comment to hang in the air. This gives the child a chance to take responsibility for their words.

Optionally, you might say: "Whoa, clearly you're disappointed. I get that. I believe you. And I know there's another way you can say that to me." This validates their feelings while maintaining a expectation of respect.

If it continues, say: "I love you, you're a good kid, you're having a hard time. I won't stay here while you keep saying this to me, and that's because it's not good for you either. I'm going to step outside and come back when we can talk about it more respectfully." (1:11:52)

Teenage Years: Separation, Staying Connected and When to Intervene (1:37:00)

The teen years involve a necessary separation as kids form their own identities. Parents may feel a deep sense of loss. While teens are pulling away, they still desperately need to know they have a "home base" in their parents.

Keep reaching out and inviting connection, even in the face of rejection. Slip notes under the door after a fight, saying something like: "That was really tough...You're a good kid and I love you." They may rip it up, but the message matters immensely.

If you notice signs of withdrawal, grades dropping, friend groups changing, excessive substance use, or pervasive conflict, it's time to insist on professional help. Make it clear that you're doing so out of love and a commitment to their safety, even if they hate you for it.

"I love you. We're in a tough stage. My number one job is to keep you safe, not to keep you happy with me. I love you so much that I'm willing to do things that make you unhappy with me. I am going to be driving you to therapy. If you want to curse at me the whole time, I will sit in that waiting room. And the next week, I'm going to tell you I love you and do the same thing." - Dr. Becky Kennedy (2:28:50)

Origin of Entitlement: Fear of Frustration (2:26:40)

Dr. Kennedy reframes entitlement as a deep fear and intolerance of frustration. If a child constantly has frustration removed and gets what they want, they don't build the capacity to withstand the inherent frustrations of life.

"Entitlement is the fear of frustration... this kid was like 'I'm frustrated, and what I expect to happen isn't here.' And so it is explosive. It appears as entitlement on the surface, but it is a deep intolerance and almost fear of frustration, which is living in your body. So you're terrified of a feeling that is living in your body. And it looks demanding because it's desperate, like you can't let this happen." - Dr. Becky Kennedy (2:38:29)

The antidote is allowing age-appropriate frustrations and building kids' ability to tolerate them. Have them join for boring errands, make them walk the long way, fold laundry together. Let them feel the discomfort, while expressing confidence they can handle it.

Conclusion

This in-depth discussion with Dr. Becky Kennedy provides a wealth of insights and practical strategies for navigating the complexities of parenting and relationships in general. By embodying "sturdiness," believing in the inherent goodness of kids, allowing for the full range of emotions while maintaining boundaries, and building capacity to tolerate frustration, we can raise resilient, capable and connected humans.

While there are no perfect parents, we can all take steps to be a sturdy "home base" for the children in our lives as they navigate the challenges of growing up. These principles can deeply impact the health of all our connections and our relationship to ourselves. Small changes in how we show up can create a powerful ripple of positive transformation.